![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
bookofmirrorsI'll probably ramble on at length, so I'll go ahead and
This post actually started in my head back when Toby did his presentations on The Temple of Set at BorderPagans. I liked what he said, a lot. I liked the premise of it, pretty much everything about it. So I talked to him personally a few times after the presentation, so I could get more information, a better feel, that sort of thing. I got to the point where all I needed to do was to write a letter stating why I wanted to be a member, and why I thought I would be good for/in the organization, and to pay the yearly dues.
And I let it slide for a while. Let it percolate in my head. In the meantime, I was also interested in Feri. Let that slide and percolate, too. Mulled it over in my head. Even finally got around to having some readings done.
Gloom and doom. So much so that I almost got the impression of "methinks thou dost protest too much".
Back to the drawing board. Because I was having trouble trusting myself as far as what I thought about joining any organization. If my tendency (and it has been, in the past) is to lose myself in an organization, and to place myself in a child role, with the organization (or people within it) as the parent, I didn't want to put myself in that situation again. However, it was an issue I'd addressed, and I really couldn't be sure if I was truly over it, except to put myself in that situation again. And the Temple of Set seemed geared towards that sort of thing not happening.
There were rules, though. As in most organizations. Not too happy with rules in general, even if I agree with them. Plus, to be a member, I had to not be a member anywhere else. All reasonable and fair, just wasn't sure if it was my bag.
More recently, I've had the opportunity to be around my former coven for magical workings. Also pleasant. Not to mention the high priest making "Fruedian" slips all the time about it. But the same issues apply as going elsewhere.
So, it all boils down to, what do I want in a working group/organization/coven/etc.?
I want freedom. Lots of it. I don't want to be limited in what I can do, what I can pursue, and what other organizations I can join.
I don't want restrictions of any kind in the magic I can perform. I don't wanna hear what white magic is, or what black magic is, or what gray magic is. I'll decide that for myself, thank you very much.
But I like working with a group. Preferably, a group I know well, and have worked with on many other ocassions in some capacity. I like the feeling of belonging. I like doing my part in rituals, and like the feedback, both positive and negative, that I get from a group.
Frankly, when it all boils down to it, I want to have my cake and eat it, too.
And I want to learn.
So, what does this mean for me joining any type of group?
Well, probably that I really can't. Which is a shame. But, as I said, I still want to learn. Most of the time, that's done by getting initiated. Not that one can't learn without being initiated. It's just the benchmark, y'know? If I tell someone that I have a bachelor's degree in psychology, and that I'm an LPN, there's a certain amount of knowledge that I'm expected to have. Ditto for magical initiations.
But, to me, I would think that a magical initiation is different. When you start that road, I think you're saying that you BELIEVE in what you're studying. Maybe this isn't really the case. I'm not a high priestess of anything, so I don't know what the rules are for any given sect. And they probably vary from person to person, sect to sect.
And the fact is, I have yet to find something that I believe in completely. So not quite sure where that leaves me.
I thought about it. Collecting initiations in different traditions. But again, I'm left with the thought that, if you take that step, you're implying belief in that particular mode of thinking. I don't want any part of that, and I have no intention of lying to anyone to get a third degree (or a thirty-third) out of it.
I thought about it some more - compared initiations (in magical/religious traditions) to degrees (in education).
Degrees impart knowledge. No particular belief is required. You pay your tuition (ahem), you show up for classes, you take the tests, and in four years, they hand you a piece of paper. You jump through the hoops, and you get a base of knowledge from which to work, and the chance at a better, higher-paying job at the end of it all. And the chance to go back and do it again, insomuch as time, money, and inclination will allow. Relatively easy.
Initiations, from my limited observance, do something very similar. Certainly, knowledge is gained. Some book learning, some experiential learning, some magical learning. Some learning that's probably not easily defined. To me, though, I would think the main thing that any type of initiation imparts is a pathway to God (however you define him/her/it/me). There are so many different pathways, all valid, all with their own truths and wisdoms. So much out there. So much to learn. And when it comes down to it, I'd love the luxury to learn all of it.
I was confirmed in the Lutheran faith as I grew up. I remember my first communion. I had a sense of awe, of adulthood, but not much of a sense of connection. I remember "converting" to Catholicism in order to avoid the annoying mixed-marriage thing when I married my first husband. I didn't believe in it. I faked it, knowingly and willfully. I figured God really didn't give a fuck when it came down to it. I was already (as was my husband, for that matter) looking down a pagan path. Certainly I learned from both these experiences. But what I learned was dogma moreso that a way to connect to God.
And since I see myself as god, therapy could just as easily be a religion of sorts for me. It's a path to myself, and therefore a path to god. But there are so many paths. I'm greedy.
So, trying not to repeat myself yet again, what it all boils down to is this:
I want it all.
I don't want to belong to any group under false pretenses. I don't want to belong to any group that will limit me in any way as to how I pursue god/myself. I want the opportunity to make mistakes and learn from them. I want to be polyamorous with god, in all facets.
That being said, I'd love to pursue initiations in as many traditions as would work with that criteria. I'd probably be happy to be with a group who understood this, and could work with it. There may or may not be groups out there like that. I don't know, and in the end, I only have to be true to myself.
This post actually started in my head back when Toby did his presentations on The Temple of Set at BorderPagans. I liked what he said, a lot. I liked the premise of it, pretty much everything about it. So I talked to him personally a few times after the presentation, so I could get more information, a better feel, that sort of thing. I got to the point where all I needed to do was to write a letter stating why I wanted to be a member, and why I thought I would be good for/in the organization, and to pay the yearly dues.
And I let it slide for a while. Let it percolate in my head. In the meantime, I was also interested in Feri. Let that slide and percolate, too. Mulled it over in my head. Even finally got around to having some readings done.
Gloom and doom. So much so that I almost got the impression of "methinks thou dost protest too much".
Back to the drawing board. Because I was having trouble trusting myself as far as what I thought about joining any organization. If my tendency (and it has been, in the past) is to lose myself in an organization, and to place myself in a child role, with the organization (or people within it) as the parent, I didn't want to put myself in that situation again. However, it was an issue I'd addressed, and I really couldn't be sure if I was truly over it, except to put myself in that situation again. And the Temple of Set seemed geared towards that sort of thing not happening.
There were rules, though. As in most organizations. Not too happy with rules in general, even if I agree with them. Plus, to be a member, I had to not be a member anywhere else. All reasonable and fair, just wasn't sure if it was my bag.
More recently, I've had the opportunity to be around my former coven for magical workings. Also pleasant. Not to mention the high priest making "Fruedian" slips all the time about it. But the same issues apply as going elsewhere.
So, it all boils down to, what do I want in a working group/organization/coven/etc.?
I want freedom. Lots of it. I don't want to be limited in what I can do, what I can pursue, and what other organizations I can join.
I don't want restrictions of any kind in the magic I can perform. I don't wanna hear what white magic is, or what black magic is, or what gray magic is. I'll decide that for myself, thank you very much.
But I like working with a group. Preferably, a group I know well, and have worked with on many other ocassions in some capacity. I like the feeling of belonging. I like doing my part in rituals, and like the feedback, both positive and negative, that I get from a group.
Frankly, when it all boils down to it, I want to have my cake and eat it, too.
And I want to learn.
So, what does this mean for me joining any type of group?
Well, probably that I really can't. Which is a shame. But, as I said, I still want to learn. Most of the time, that's done by getting initiated. Not that one can't learn without being initiated. It's just the benchmark, y'know? If I tell someone that I have a bachelor's degree in psychology, and that I'm an LPN, there's a certain amount of knowledge that I'm expected to have. Ditto for magical initiations.
But, to me, I would think that a magical initiation is different. When you start that road, I think you're saying that you BELIEVE in what you're studying. Maybe this isn't really the case. I'm not a high priestess of anything, so I don't know what the rules are for any given sect. And they probably vary from person to person, sect to sect.
And the fact is, I have yet to find something that I believe in completely. So not quite sure where that leaves me.
I thought about it. Collecting initiations in different traditions. But again, I'm left with the thought that, if you take that step, you're implying belief in that particular mode of thinking. I don't want any part of that, and I have no intention of lying to anyone to get a third degree (or a thirty-third) out of it.
I thought about it some more - compared initiations (in magical/religious traditions) to degrees (in education).
Degrees impart knowledge. No particular belief is required. You pay your tuition (ahem), you show up for classes, you take the tests, and in four years, they hand you a piece of paper. You jump through the hoops, and you get a base of knowledge from which to work, and the chance at a better, higher-paying job at the end of it all. And the chance to go back and do it again, insomuch as time, money, and inclination will allow. Relatively easy.
Initiations, from my limited observance, do something very similar. Certainly, knowledge is gained. Some book learning, some experiential learning, some magical learning. Some learning that's probably not easily defined. To me, though, I would think the main thing that any type of initiation imparts is a pathway to God (however you define him/her/it/me). There are so many different pathways, all valid, all with their own truths and wisdoms. So much out there. So much to learn. And when it comes down to it, I'd love the luxury to learn all of it.
I was confirmed in the Lutheran faith as I grew up. I remember my first communion. I had a sense of awe, of adulthood, but not much of a sense of connection. I remember "converting" to Catholicism in order to avoid the annoying mixed-marriage thing when I married my first husband. I didn't believe in it. I faked it, knowingly and willfully. I figured God really didn't give a fuck when it came down to it. I was already (as was my husband, for that matter) looking down a pagan path. Certainly I learned from both these experiences. But what I learned was dogma moreso that a way to connect to God.
And since I see myself as god, therapy could just as easily be a religion of sorts for me. It's a path to myself, and therefore a path to god. But there are so many paths. I'm greedy.
So, trying not to repeat myself yet again, what it all boils down to is this:
I want it all.
I don't want to belong to any group under false pretenses. I don't want to belong to any group that will limit me in any way as to how I pursue god/myself. I want the opportunity to make mistakes and learn from them. I want to be polyamorous with god, in all facets.
That being said, I'd love to pursue initiations in as many traditions as would work with that criteria. I'd probably be happy to be with a group who understood this, and could work with it. There may or may not be groups out there like that. I don't know, and in the end, I only have to be true to myself.
